**Official** New Zealand in Australia

[Polo23]

I'm praying Watson is picked ahead of Symonds. That would be awesome.

 

[Prince EWS]

Yeah, I understand that. But what exactly are we supposed to do about it?

Whether you can do much about it is irrelevant to the fact that it's a very real problem. I know a bag the NZ selectors a lot but that particular post wasn't designed that way - I was merely backing up my opinion that the NZ batting lineup, as it stands, is terrible and will more than likely struggle big time in Australia.

I don't think it'll be a contest and some people disagreed so I showed why I thought such. The difference in batting credentials in so, so vast. Flynn, Redmond and How aren't even proven First Class players.

 

[NZTailender]

Hmm, could some of our top order batting issues be related to a lack of variation?

Since the start of this millenium, we've had just 8 left hand players bat in the top 7 positions, two of those players being Vettori and Franklin, so really 6 specialist left handers in the past 8 years.

On the other hand ( ) there have been about 20+ specialist right handers (a few all-rounders there), most of whom have been tried and failed.

Only 3 of the left-handers have played more than 10 Tests - those three being Stephen Fleming, Mark Richardson and Jacob Oram.

Comparitively there have been 14 right handed players to play more than 10 tests in the same period - Adam Parore, Matthew Horne, Craig Cumming, Matthew Bell, Jamie How, Ross Taylor, Hamish Marshall, Chris Cairns, Lou Vincent, Mathew Sinclair, Scott Styris, Brendon McCullum, Craig McMillan and Nathan Astle.

The overall totals for this period is
Right-handers: 30 players 68 matches, 16013 runs @ 30.50 30 centuries 75 fifties
Left-handers: 8 players 68 matches 9127 runs @ 40.20 16 hundreds 48 fifties

Broken down that's 1140.88 runs per lefty, 553.77 runs per righty.

Seam bowlers are generally more used to bowling to right handed batsman, so left-handers can create problems by adding variation to the batting line up.

It's possible that our batting could improve here on in, since two left-handers have debuted recently in Flynn and Ryder? Plus Oram when he's fit and Vettori with insane numbers at number 8, the left-hand right-hand variations and combinations could be a good thing for us.

Funnily enough, Tim McIntosh could figure into this. IIRC he's probably the only left-handed opener playing cricket in NZ currently? Or at least, the only established/experienced one.
He's been talked up, and equally, talked down here very recently, but reckon he could be worth a punt at home vs the WIndies? It'd mean we'd have a left-right opening combo, and exactly half of the batsmen in the top 8 would be lefties.
Edit: haha I fail at maths. 5 of the 8 would be lefties (forgot to count Oram).

Probably overly simplistic and we shouldn't give caps to players simply for being left-handed, but it may be just the thing to help our rather weak batting. Ryder certainly is a step forward in that department. There aren't a whole heap of other candidates (not including recent Under-19 guys) who average over 30 AFAIK, basically McIntosh, Todd and Dewayne Bowden.

 

[NZTailender]

Also, didn't realise just how good Cairns's batting stats for that period were. Sigh, if it weren't for injuries...

 

[Polo23]

Whether you can do much about it is irrelevant to the fact that it's a very real problem. I know a bag the NZ selectors a lot but that particular post wasn't designed that way - I was merely backing up my opinion that the NZ batting lineup, as it stands, is terrible and will more than likely struggle big time in Australia.

I don't think it'll be a contest and some people disagreed so I showed why I thought such. The difference in batting credentials in so, so vast. Flynn, Redmond and How aren't even proven First Class players.

I disagree that our batting lineup is terrible. Inexperienced and yet to fulfill it's potential, yes, but not terrible. Also, I don't think there is a problem, for the 3rd time, we have the best guys in the team, there isnt anything else we can do.

How and Redmond are very proven first class players. Over the past few years they have been 2 of the top scorers in NZ domestic cricket.

 

[S.P. Fleming]

I dont think that left handers have been too much of a problem, in the last few years we had two in our top 6 which isnt very different to most countries. I do agree that it could be healthy for the mix of the side that Ryder and Flynn are both lefties.

 

[Prince EWS]

Also, I don't think there is a problem, for the 3rd time, we have the best guys in the team, there isnt anything else we can do.

And for the third time, that's not relevant. Not being able to do better has no bearing on the actual quality and I think it's debatable anyway (not that I'm going to get sucked into that debate as it'd detract from my point).

If Papua New Guinea were a Test nation, they'd field a ridiculously bad batting lineup, even if they picked their best and brightest talents. Now I'm not saying New Zealand are as bad as PNG by any stretch but the fact that you'd can't do better has no bearing on the actual quality of what you put out.

You may disagree that they are terrible but what you can do about it and the alternatives available are not factors in the quality of the batting. They're going to be as good as they are whether there are players to take their spots or not. As I said, I'm not criticising the selection; I'm merely expressing my thoughts on the team as it is.

 

[Polo23]

Your agument is less relevant than my argument. What point are you trying to make by saying "we are superior and you are crap"? I think everyone knows NZ will likely struggle.

 

[NZTailender]

I dont think that left handers have been too much of a problem, in the last few years we had two in our top 6 which isnt very different to most countries. I do agree that it could be healthy for the mix of the side that Ryder and Flynn are both lefties.

I didn't say they were a problem, I said the lack of them is a problem!

 

[Flem274*]

I don't really care how they bat or what their FC average is, I'll settle for some runs thanks.

Good work Bahnzy mate btw, back to your old emo self.

 

[Raghav]

NZ will start their tour in about 10 hours from now...

looking forward to how they perform

 

[four_or_six]

Hayden wants Symonds back.

 

[Raghav]

The probables for tomorrow:

New Zealand: Daniel Vettori (capt), Jamie How, Aaron Redmond, Jesse Ryder, Ross Taylor, Brendon McCullum, Daniel Flynn, Kyle Mills, Tim Southee, Iain O'Brien, Chris Martin.

 

[Polo23]

Hayden wants Symonds back.

Vettori probably does too.

 

[howardj]

Ponting Tips Recall

My tip is he will be named in a squad of 13, but miss the final XI

 

[howardj]

Hayden wants Symonds back.

But Taylor Doesn't

Agree with Taylor to an extent when he says:

"The thing about Symonds is that he has always been keen. But he has been on about all this stuff about whether they (Cricket Australia) supported him (in last summer's racial dispute). It's just rubbish".

"You have to fit in with other people in this game. It's a team game. You don't always get what you want."

 

[four_or_six]

Ponting Tips Recall

My tip is he will be named in a squad of 13, but miss the final XI

Surely it would be better if they just make a decision one way or another, otherwise they just leave two players on hot coals for a whole week.

 

[Silver Arrow]

Vettori has won the toss and decided to bat first against NSW

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

I can't see how Symonds would play. They won't drop Watson for him, because he played well in India, and they won't drop any of the top 5 batsmen for him because they are all firmly established. The only viable option would be to drop Krezja and only play three specialist bowlers.

Seems unlikely to me.

 

[Silver Arrow]

Josh Hazelwood got his first first-class wicket that of Aaron Redmond who was out for 5

NZ 14/1