On Picking an English Keeper

[Goughy]

Its no secret that England have had keeper concerns since Stewart retired and virtually every series begins with a different incumbant.

As well people popping in and out everyone has a favourite.

I was thinking of a way to give a nod to batting and keeping in who should be selected and attempt to take all the messy bias and opinion out of it.

So, Id like English fans to make 2 lists.

5 best batsmen who keep in the Country
(and bold the best keeper)

5 best pure wicketkeepers in the Country
(and bold the best batsman)

Ideally the same player would be bolded in both lists. However, rather than having 8 names thrown around this may help to narrow down what is important and put about 2-3 names in the mix.

 

[zaremba]

Batsmen who keep
1. Matt Prior
2. Andy Hodd
3. Tim Ambrose
4. James Foster
5. Stephen Davies

(6. Nick Potarse
7. Geraint Jones)

Pure keepers
1. Chris Read
2. Hodd
3. Foster
4. Ambrose

 

[Richard]

Hmm, probably subject to change but...

I'll exclude Jonathan Batty, Nic Pothas and Paul Nixon as, for mine, they're all now too old to be being considered for international debuts. I'm never enormously in favour of someone in their mid-30s debuting - continuing, absolutely fine, keep playing until you're not good enough any more, but debuting - very hestitant. Read, also, obviously excluded due to his ICL connections. I'm also not sure whether Gerard Brophy and Riki Wessels are England-eligable so I'll leave them out.

Considering the First-Class game; one-day cricket ignored completely.

Trouble is I really don't know all that much about who the good domestic wicketkeepers are, as you need to watch lots of them to tell that. And the only domestic cricket we get televised is one-day cricket, which is really little challenge to a wicketkeeper compared to the First-Class game. The wicketkeepers are a fair piece of guesswork - basically those who I know are decent wicketkeepers are picked instead of those I know nothing about.

Best batsmen who keep:
1. Steven Davies (potentially so - he isn't there yet)
2. Tim Ambrose
3. Matthew Prior (though I don't believe his wicketkeeping of acceptable standard)
4. David Nash (appears not to be playing currently, not sure why)
5. Niall O'Brien
Also worth mention: Stephen Snell, Craig Kieswetter (both young or young-ish and with the potential to kick-on).

Best wicketkeepers:
1. James Foster
2. Tim Ambrose
3. Luke Sutton
4. James Pipe
5. Mark Wallace

BTW this is probably the best place to mention - at this guy - Warwickshire's fourth-choice wicketkeeper. With Ambrose (this season averaging 112), Frost (this season averaging 88) and Johnson (72 in his only innings this season) being ahead. No little to live-up to there then.

 

[Goughy]

and I wanted people to bold the best keeper in the batsman list and bold the best batsman on the keeping list

 

[BoyBrumby]

If we're picking an English keeper that'a Ambrose, Prior, Jones & Pothas buggered for a start.

I'm here all week, take my wife....please.

 

[Goughy]

Can't choose a best keeper, sorry. Not Prior or Jones.

Go on stick your neck out

 

[Goughy]

I like the idea of showing logic behind choices rather than it seemingly at random.

Id love the logic of "We highlighted a small group who we think are the best keepers in the country and then we selected Player X as he was the best batsman of the group"

or

"We highlighted a small group who we think are the best batsmen who keep wicket in the country and then we selected Player X as he was the best keeper of the group"

 

[aussie]

Agree with Richard's selection & based on that given that for me the best England XI with the keeper spot up for a debate should be:

Strauss
Cook
Vaughan
KP
Bell
Collingwood
Flintoff
Keeper?
Jones
Hoggard/Sidebottom
Panesar

Probably the best keeper in the land should be picked which is between Foster & Ambrose for me.

 

[Richard]

If we're picking an English keeper that'a Ambrose, Prior, Jones & Pothas buggered for a start.

And Wessels and Brophy too, of course.

Amazing how many counties now have a non-UK-born player as their wicketkeeper.

 

[zaremba]

Go on stick your neck out

Oh alright then Andy Hodd. Duly edited.

 

[Jono]

England should just stop picking a keeper. Its become embarrassing. Sort of like openers for Pakistan.

 

[Goughy]

Oh alright then Andy Hodd. Duly edited.

Who does he play for and who do you support?

TBF, I know little about him. You have him rated as the best keeper of the good bats and the best bat of the good keepers. That is high praise.

On that analysis he should be in the England team.

 

[andruid]

Best batsmen who keep:
1. Steven Davies (potentially so - he isn't there yet)
2. Tim Ambrose
3. Matthew Prior (though I don't believe his wicketkeeping of acceptable standard)
4. David Nash (appears not to be playing currently, not sure why)
5. Niall O'Brien
Also worth mention: Stephen Snell, Craig Kieswetter (both young or young-ish and with the potential to kick-on).

Umm English Keepers....

 

[zaremba]

Who does he play for and who do you support?

TBF, I know little about him. You have him rated as the best keeper of the good bats and the best bat of the good keepers. That is high praise.

On that analysis he should be in the England team.

Yes he and I are both fortunate to come from Championshire. The problem is that at the moment he's NOT playing for Sussex because Prior's keeping him out! There is a lot of disquiet about this from the supporters.

He is a correct batsman with good concentration, with a first class average just below 40. He's a neat keeper, far better than Prior. I wouldn't say he's in Read's class with the gloves but he is certainly very competent.

He will I imagine soon be signed by another county, will score tons of runs and be passed the poisoned chalice by, er, ex-Sussex keeper Peter Moores. (cf Tim Ambrose).

 

[Lillian Thomson]

The only two international class keepers are Read and Foster, after that you can draw lots (which is what they appear to have been doing anyway). Prior, Jones and Ambrose are all good enough to bat at number seven but not good enough keepers.
Then of course there's Andy Hodd.

Hopefully Stuart Broad will progress as a bowler and then he can bat at seven and stop this keeper merry-go-round altogether and just choose the best keeper.

 

[zaremba]

Then of course there's Andy Hodd.

"But they mocked Hodd's messengers, despised his words and scoffed at his prophets until the wrath of the LORD was aroused against his people and there was no remedy." 2 Chronicles 32:16

Ye mockers and scoffers will repent when the Hodd cometh.

And that's all I shall say on the matter.

 

[superkingdave]

Cross, if only he could get a gig ahead of Sutton

 

[steds]

Best wicketkeepers:
1. James Foster
2. Tim Ambrose
3. Luke Sutton
4. James Pipe
5. Mark Wallace

Reckon you're overrating Sutton a fair bit, but other than that, that looks about right to me.

Not prepared to comment on the best batsmen, because every single keeper England have tried since Stewart has managed to look utterly inept, regardless of many many runs they've compiled at County level. Actually starting to believe the English wicketkeeper who can score runs is a myth.

 

[Burgey]

England should just stop picking a keeper. Its become embarrassing. Sort of like openers for Pakistan.

Yep, it's getting like spinners for Australia these days.

 

[Uppercut]

Prior is probably the best batsman. And the worst keeper.