***Official*** English Domestic Season 2008

[wpdavid]

Really looking forward to Durham - Kent, but Colville has annoyed me already. Three times he's said that Collingwood 'insisted on playing' today. It's six days to the Test, ffs, and Andrew Strauss has just started a three-day game against South Africa.

Durham won toss and put Kent in.

... who have raced to 81 for 0 at 5 an over. Harmison's first has just gone for 13.

 

[aussie]

My my this Denley bloke looks very impressive, once he keeps playing like this he eventually should be opening in ODI's for ENG no doubt..

 

[stumpski]

Yeah, Pollock's had some punishment - he's suffered from the combination of lack of swing and fast outfield. Key has played some cracking shots. Harmison has been expensive so far but he's building up some good pace.

 

[stumpski]

Ton up for Denly, and Collingwood into the attack at 173-1. 15 overs to go - 300 should be on here.

 

[Prince EWS]

Although your reasons for not being overly confident of picking Flintoff & Jones in a 4-man bowling attack is fair given their injury record. But if we are going to now pick them & yet have to unbalance the side with the thought at the back of our minds that they could break down any minute in a test match, well then why consider them at all regardless of their ability?

But given that ENG cannot forget such players, it is pretty much up to the physio/doctors etc to give the selectors the green light that these two slatwarts can last 5 days, since as i said it makes no sense picking them if they have the bodies of 70 year olds.

Once their fitness is claried then the best ENG XI for me would be:

Strauss
Cook
Vaughan
KP
Bell
Collingwood
Flintoff
Ambrose
Jones
Sidebottom/Hoggard
Panesar

Obviously some players have question marks over them or competition:

Strauss - needs to overcome to SA so as to convince all he is back.

Cook - although of late looks at bit sluggish & tentative at the crease would be backing him to come good, has the natural ability to do it IMHO

Bell - needs to take it to the next level pretty soon.

Ambrose - potentially has Prior (if his glovework improves) & Foster breathing down his neck if he lapses.

Sidebottom/Hoggard - well you would agree Hoggard hasn't really lost anything just was dropped foolishly in NZ (Anderson saving the selectors blushes with a good performance) & can't be recalled unless one of Broad/Anderson fails. So given that Freddie & Jones once fit are our two most reliable bowlers in most conditions we would only have room for one swing bowler so depending on who shows the best form will decide which of Sidebottom/Hoggard plays.

Flintoff should not be batting ahead of Ambrose AFAIC. Regardless of what his form is like.

 

[wpdavid]

Ton up for Denly, and Collingwood into the attack at 173-1. 15 overs to go - 300 should be on here.

....and he went for 14 in his first over. Kent accelerating nicely, with Kemp waiting in the wings.

 

[Spitfires_Fan]

Kent's recent performances have reminded me how glad I am that Graham Ford didn't go off to coach India. He's overseen a massive turnaround in the limited overs side of the game for Kent, and it's great to see Denly playing a big part in that. Ford's been criticised by some for bringing in so many South Africans, but Denly was the main man in the 20:20 group stages and he's doing a fine job again today.

 

[stumpski]

Denly gone to a Harmy yorker, to be replaced by Mahmood. But the in-form Van Jaarsveld is past 50 and started with two hard-hit pulls for 4 in Morkel's new spell.

Kent batting very deep here, Tredwell down at 10 has been batting 3 in the Championship.

 

[wpdavid]

Denly gone.

And Mahmood batting ahead of Kemp

 

[Richard]

My my this Denley bloke looks very impressive, once he keeps playing like this he eventually should be opening in ODI's for ENG no doubt..

This is precisely the sort of attitude that's caused so many problems for England's ODI team in recent years.

This might possibly be the first really good OD innings Denly has played in his career. Proves precisely nothing until he can do it plenty times more.

 

[Langeveldt]

This is precisely the sort of attitude that's caused so many problems for England's ODI team in recent years.

This might possibly be the first really good OD innings Denly has played in his career. Proves precisely nothing until he can do it plenty times more.

Isn't "one good one day innings" precisely why Ravi Bopara is in the team?

 

[Prince EWS]

Isn't "one good one day innings" precisely why Ravi Bopara is in the team?

Well not really; he was in the team before that innings anyway. Outside of international level where he's mainly batted out of position, he still has 1895 List A runs @ 34 even when you exclude that double ton. Obviously it's not an irrestible case for selection but it's not a horrible record. When you combine that with the fact that he's in fine touch in both forms of the game this season and then add his spectacular innings, his selection is perfectly reasonable.

I'm far from convinced Bopara will turn out to be any good but it's a totally different situation to Denly who has had a very poor one day career so far. Even this year in which he has supposedly improved out of sight in the format, his strike rate is in the 60s and he averaged 40 before today's innings.

Given how good a Test prospect he is, there are few things that could worse for him at the moment than ruining his confidence and quite possibly his technique by playing him at international level in a format he's never had any real success in. I actually think England would even be better off playing with ten men than playing Denly - purely for the good of his career - the selection would be that ridiculous.

All that said, Richard's post was a bit OTT because Aussie wasn't actually calling for him to selected now. Aussie even gave the "once he keeps playing like this" condition so I see nothing so wrong with his post that deserved the attack Richard launched into.

 

[Richard]

The fact that it was "once he keeps playing like this" rather than "if he keeps playing like this" was what irritated me sufficiently. Too many people watch a single innings and suddenly decide someone is brilliant and will obviously keep scoring. I'll admit I did it myself with Mark Alleyne in 1999, and he was someone who always disappointed me as a result of that.

And frankly, you can watch any old innings from any old player and think "if he keeps playing like this he should play for <his national team>". It's pretty basic common-sense that you score runs, you put yourself in the frame.

 

[Prince EWS]

The fact that it was "once he keeps playing like this" rather than "if he keeps playing like this" was what irritated me sufficiently. Too many people watch a single innings and suddenly decide someone is brilliant and will obviously keep scoring. I'll admit I did it myself with Mark Alleyne in 1999, and he was someone who always disappointed me as a result of that.

And frankly, you can watch any old innings from any old player and think "if he keeps playing like this he should play for <his national team>". It's pretty basic common-sense that you score runs, you put yourself in the frame.

Aussie's assumption may have been a tad optomistic but "once he keeps playing like this he'll make the team" isn't the sort of attitude that has caused so many problems for England's ODI team in recent years. It'll lead you to serial disappointment indeed but it won't lead to selection problems. What leads to selection problems is "now he's going to keep playing like this so he should be in the team now".

 

[open365]

Isn't "one good one day innings" precisely why Ravi Bopara is in the team?

Like EWS said, Bopara has been the next England ODI prospect since halfway through 06.

I don't think he's particulary that good either.

 

[Richard]

Aussie's assumption may have been a tad optomistic but "once he keeps playing like this he'll make the team" isn't the sort of attitude that has caused so many problems for England's ODI team in recent years. It'll lead you to serial disappointment indeed but it won't lead to selection problems. What leads to selection problems is "now he's going to keep playing like this so he should be in the team now".

I have to wonder whether there wasn't anything like that in sentiment if not expressed in that post TBH, but never mind.

 

[Langeveldt]

Such a fan of van Jaarsveld.. Seems like a nice guy with his head screwed on as well.. How long until he qualifies for England?

 

[Manee]

Such a fan of van Jaarsveld.. Seems like a nice guy with his head screwed on as well.. How long until he qualifies for England?

Don't quote me, but I played today and it came up in conversation that it is two more years.

 

[tooextracool]

Although your reasons for not being overly confident of picking Flintoff & Jones in a 4-man bowling attack is fair given their injury record. But if we are going to now pick them & yet have to unbalance the side with the thought at the back of our minds that they could break down any minute in a test match, well then why consider them at all regardless of their ability?.

Because the 2 of them offer more to the side than any other bowler in England when they are fit. The fact that they are accidents waiting to happen doesnt mean they dont deserve to play for England until that accident does happen.

But given that ENG cannot forget such players, it is pretty much up to the physio/doctors etc to give the selectors the green light that these two slatwarts can last 5 days, since as i said it makes no sense picking them if they have the bodies of 70 year olds.

Its not about their bodies. Jones has always been supremely fit and was easily one of the best fielders in the side when he played. The problem is that in Flintoff's case his bowling involves putting heavy stress on his ankle and while he may pass fitness tests and what not, he could at any point in time injure it again. Like Atherton did for most of his career, Flintoff will have to play through the pain barrier and play with drugs for the majority of his career. Jones has pretty much every possible injury and one has to consider that his knee (either one) is subject to serious injury even with the slightest damage. Again both will pass fitness tests but theres no telling what slight incident can put them out of the game.

 

[Perm]

My my this Denley bloke looks very impressive, once he keeps playing like this he eventually should be opening in ODI's for ENG no doubt..

Eventually? Well, maybe if he continues playing innings like that. Too date he hasn't really done much, so I wouldn't be talking him up as an ODI prospect.

Lovin' his nickname too.