**Official** Australia in West Indies

[pasag]

Only 120 to get. Windies in with a shot if Sammy can stick around.

No chance against Lee and Clark.

 

[sideshowtim]

One of the most deserved 5fers you'll see.

 

[pasag]

Clark gets a 5fer, does the business.

 

[pasag]

Nice win, nice Test.

If the WI play like this for the rest of the series (bat fifth day's batting) it should be a cracker.

 

[sideshowtim]

Well, I always say it...These days, it doesn't matter who you're playing, if you win the First Test away from home when you've had barely any preparation...You've done a bloody good job.

 

[social]

Well, I always say it...These days, it doesn't matter who you're playing, if you win the First Test away from home when you've had barely any preparation...You've done a bloody good job.

To a degree

WI has a couple of world class players, couple promising and a couple that really stood up in this test BUT they are not a good team

Australia survived on the back of 2 bowlers, catching was pretty awful and a few of the bats need a long hard look at themselves

In other words, zero has changed since last summer

 

[pasag]

Clark MOTM, definitely deserved though I would have given it to Symonds personally.

Btw, just goes to show how important these pitches are for cricket. Both here and in England. Hope it continues but I won't hold my breath.

 

[aussie tragic]

he he, MacGill on a hat trick next ball he bowls.....will he ever get the chance

 

[sideshowtim]

Clark MOTM, definitely deserved though I would have given it to Symonds personally.

Btw, just goes to show how important these pitches are for cricket. Both here and in England. Hope it continues but I won't hold my breath.

Yes, I loved these pitches. Very sporting. Runs in it if you were good enough, wickets in it if you bowled well enough.

 

[Mister Wright]

Thought it was a bit rough the Symonds didn't get MOTM, fair enough Clark bowled them to victory, but wouldn't have had much to bowl at if it wasn't for Symonds' 140+ runs for the game.

 

[Burgey]

I gather from the last few pages that MacGill was dire. How was JOhnson? Much improvement on the 1st innings, and did he bowl his annual inswinger in this innings, or is he saving it up?

Assuming Clarke is back, do they run with Noffke or Bollinger instead of MacGill and share the spinning duties between Clarke and Symonds?
And can someone tell us what the wicket normally plays like at the new Antigua ground (it is a new ground right, not the old Recreation Ground)?

 

[Malleeboy]

Looks like Clarke will come back in for Hodge.
If Hayden fit he replaces Katich.

If you end up with having Katich, Clarke and Symonds in a team do you really need MacGill?
Actually Punter didn't give Katich a bowl at all, I wonder if the thinking was...
1) Give MacGill enough overs and he might find form
or
2) Katich might show him up and destroy his confidence
I wonder if Clarke had been in the team he would have got a trundle.


I think Noffke deserve a crack but I can't see the selectors dropping the number 1 spinner, they'll persist and just hope he finds form. Then it would Johnson to make way for Noffke. Although personally I'd keep Johnson and drop MacGill.

So for me....

Hayden (if not ready then Katich..)
Jaques
Ponting
Hussey
Clarke
Symonds
Haddin
Noffke
Lee
Johnson
Clark

A tail that should wag, and a varied bowling attack with some form bowlers, just no front line spinner....

 

[aussie]

All this MacGill bashing seems a bish harsh IMO. Yea he bowled crap & looked very old surprisingly geez. But fact is he was out injured & did look far better when he played SRI in the AUS summer.

So for me i'd give him another test & probably the entire series, backing him to improve because he is still the best spinner available & with the Indian tour later this year he has a big role to play.

 

[Malleeboy]

Undoubtedly the selectors will stick with him for probably the whole series, I just don't personally think he'll come good. I hope he does but how long has he really got left at the top anyway (even if he miraclously get there). Undoubtedly he has suffered the misfortune of being in Warne's hefty shadow but sentiment can only be carried so far. We carried Dizzy on sentiment and that assisted in us getting done by the Poms.

He is in the side cause the two better players have retired. Maybe we could offer Warne to only bowl 5 overs a day and an unlimited free text contract, right now I'd take 5 from Warne over 20 from MacGill. I even think in current form even George Bradley would be more menancing to the Windies and he can actually bat and field as a bonus.

 

[MrHat]

Noffke for Johnson. We need a proper swinger to go with two out and out seamers, besides Noffke outperformed him when they bowled together for QLD last season

 

[Top_Cat]

Undoubtedly the selectors will stick with him for probably the whole series, I just don't personally think he'll come good. I hope he does but how long has he really got left at the top anyway (even if he miraclously get there). Undoubtedly he has suffered the misfortune of being in Warne's hefty shadow but sentiment can only be carried so far. We carried Dizzy on sentiment and that assisted in us getting done by the Poms.

He is in the side cause the two better players have retired. Maybe we could offer Warne to only bowl 5 overs a day and an unlimited free text contract, right now I'd take 5 from Warne over 20 from MacGill. I even think in current form even George Bradley would be more menancing to the Windies and he can actually bat and field as a bonus.

I'm as much a Magill basher as anyone but, after surgery to correct Carpal Tunnel Syndrome, did anyone honestly expect him to be ripping the ball miles and landing it on a length? His recovery will take time. Warne had finger surgery which affected him for the rest of his career (after 1996, he essentially lost the ability to bowl the flipper completely) so work on an area infinitely more complex like the wrist will also take a long time. he needs this series to get some overs under his belt for India because the Aussies will need him there.

 

[Malleeboy]

But its not as if he is a player at the beginning or middle of his career. His form wasn't good before the operation, so even if he gets back to pre-op form, will that be good enough.
And how old will he be, when and if he does get form back.

They'll stick with him purely on the grounds that his potential, limited as it is, is still better then anything else we've got.

But if we ended up with Clarke, Katich and Symonds in the side for any length of time, does that mitigate the need for a spinner, if we've got class pacemen and an array of part timers who can chip in.

Did the MacGill situation (the need to get bowling under his belt) stop Ponting from giving Katich a bowl?

 

[howardj]

Noffke for Johnson. We need a proper swinger to go with two out and out seamers, besides Noffke outperformed him when they bowled together for QLD last season

Yeah, I remember Qld v SL back in November just before the 1st Test. Noffke clearly outbowled Johnson, and I've seen nothing since then that suggests Johnson is a better red ball bowler. I think Johnson is much like Bracken - can make the white ball talk, but merely angles the red ball across the batsman. Johnson hasn't played too much FC cricket, so perhaps he will develop his skills in this area. However, it's arguable whether the Test arena is the theatre in which you should be trying to develop such a fundamental skill for a left-armer.

 

[Top_Cat]

But its not as if he is a player at the beginning or middle of his career. His form wasn't good before the operation, so even if he gets back to pre-op form, will that be good enough.
And how old will he be, when and if he does get form back.

They'll stick with him purely on the grounds that his potential, limited as it is, is still better then anything else we've got.

But if we ended up with Clarke, Katich and Symonds in the side for any length of time, does that mitigate the need for a spinner, if we've got class pacemen and an array of part timers who can chip in.

Did the MacGill situation (the need to get bowling under his belt) stop Ponting from giving Katich a bowl?

Good God, Katich should not be anywhere near the bowling crease in a Test. Symonds and Clarke as part-timers, sure, but the Kat should be a net bowler.

As for Magill, now is the time I think for the Aussie selectors to make a call one way or the other (if they haven't already). Either give him plenty of overs in this series to prepare for India or cut their losses and go with someone else. In India, you need at least one spinner so I'd suggest they won't be dropping him any time soon. There's nothing to suggest any of the other pace bowlers will do any better in India so it's no surprise.

Yeah, I remember Qld v SL back in November just before the 1st Test. Noffke clearly outbowled Johnson, and I've seen nothing since then that suggests Johnson is a better red ball bowler. I think Johnson is much like Bracken - can make the white ball talk, but merely angles the red ball across the batsman. Johnson hasn't played too much FC cricket, so perhaps he will develop his skills in this area. However, it's arguable whether the Test arena is the theatre in which you should be trying to develop such a fundamental skill for a left-armer.

It's arguable whether he should be trying to develop in-swing full stop. He's a little different to Bracken in that he's yards quicker which lessens the probability of swing by itself. That Bracken couldn't consistently swing the red ball at his pace means he has little else to work with but with Johnson, he's a hit-the-deck bowler and really quick so I reckon, rather than trying to redevelop his bowling to develop a weakness, play to his strengths. Swing ain't one of them. The example of Glenn McGrath, dropped after trying to swing the ball unsuccessfully against England in '94, should tell people that trying to boost perceived weaknesses in one's game to the detriment of existing strengths just makes for an ordinary bowler all-round.

 

[MrHat]

Yeah, I remember Qld v SL back in November just before the 1st Test. Noffke clearly outbowled Johnson, and I've seen nothing since then that suggests Johnson is a better red ball bowler. I think Johnson is much like Bracken - can make the white ball talk, but merely angles the red ball across the batsman. Johnson hasn't played too much FC cricket, so perhaps he will develop his skills in this area. However, it's arguable whether the Test arena is the theatre in which you should be trying to develop such a fundamental skill for a left-armer.

I'd take even take Bracks over Johnson too tbh, theres too much of a sameness with Lee and Clarke as both can swing it but only under optimum conditions. Bracken will at least give you good propects for wickets with the new ball, with 3 or 4 overs of good swing bowling garuanteed. I remember Lara being consistently troubled by Bracks during their last tour to Aus when he took a 5 fer. He has the propensity to suddenly fall away though so we need someone a bit more mentally tough.

Fast bowling stocks aren't that great right now but Noffers has experience (well age) and is a actual swing bowler