Being Magnanimous in Defeat

[Langeveldt]

I'm actually inclined to agree with Jason on this one, a lot of bull**** regularly gets spouted by Arthur and Smith, it makes me ashamed to be an SA fan sometimes.. Okay they come up with the odd pretty comment in a press conference, but they come across as being a very arrogant pair...

However, if Jason is still carrying his grudge against SA since pulling out of that series in Colombo, then shame on him.. The outcry against that was totally uncalled for, from guys living sheltered lives posting on an internet forum, I don't think they had much right to call us cowards for leaving a city during a bomb blast without having a clue what the situation was like on the ground..

Jason's obviously done his cause no good with the comments following his original post, but I think he makes a valid point.. My personal dislike of his team has rapidly faded following the exemplary way in which they conducted their cricket during this whole tournament.. Makes me forget about guys like Arjuna Ranatunga..

 

[Fiery]

No, I don't - typing stars is not avoiding the filter. Nor is saying FFS or WTF - otherwise the hundreds of posters that do both ATT would be pulled-up.

It's not trivial - avoiding the filter WILL get you into trouble, and I'm advising people that it's not the best course of action. If a mod spots it, you'll start getting warnings before long.

Can't see the difference myself

 

[jot1]

I have no problem with people not liking our team or our captain. Or even that people think Smith is arrogant. As they don't know him personally, that doesn't really mean much. What I do object to, are statements like these.

In this World Cup I have only come across one Team that has been a sore loser or kept finding excuses time after time everytime they lost.

Whenever they lost they never acknowledged that they lost to the better Team.

They never admitted or acknowledged they were beaten by the better Team on the day.

To me it seems a lack of magnanimity in admitting they lost to the better team...is part of this SA Team leadership.

Not true. THEY didn't KEEP finding excuses. There were times when things went against them and those things were mentioned. Not just by the team but by the commentators, the press, etc.
They DID admit and acknowledge they were beaten by the better team on the day. After every match we lost Smith congratulated the winning team publicly and said they batted and/or bowled better.
Smith also publicly apologised to the Saffie fans for their poor showing at the World Cup. I don't know if any other team captain did that. In my book that shows humility not arrogance.
I don't know what people expect a team to say at a press conference when asked stupid questions like, " Are you confidant you can win?"
"No, we're scared to death and we know we're going to lose.?"
Any other answer, it seems, is seen as arrogance.

 

[Richard]

Can't see the difference myself

I can sort of forgive you for failing to see it in the FFS and WTF (which I'll come to) but in the stars that just baffles logic. The whole point of the filter is that it is the stars. Avoiding the filter is doing stuff to stop certain words being starred-out. No-one knows who presses 4 stars and who types a word and who lets the filter do its work - the result is the same.

Now, avoiding typing filtered words ITFP is different - and if you suggest people shouldn't be typing them, well, fair enough. But fortunately no-one does suggest that (though there was a time, not so long ago, when they did) and it's not against forum rules to have posts including a line of stars... though if people do such things very regularly it does, of course, cast aspersions on said person's character.

As regards abbreviations, the whole point of the filter is that people who don't want to see filtered words (or a don't want to see a three-letter-and-one-star set, or a slight deliberate misspelling, that makes it perfectly clear what you mean) don't see them. Nor do they see them in an abbreviation, and the chances are they won't understand what said abbreviation means, either, so no offence is caused.

 

[Dick Rockett]

Looks like the real Jason has returned. Now I await the return of his usage of emoticons as punctuation.

 

[Smudge]

Looks like the real Jason has returned. Now I await the return of his usage of emoticons as punctuation.

So do I. Can't wait.

 

[JASON]

I'm actually inclined to agree with Jason on this one, a lot of bull**** regularly gets spouted by Arthur and Smith, it makes me ashamed to be an SA fan sometimes.. Okay they come up with the odd pretty comment in a press conference, but they come across as being a very arrogant pair...

However, if Jason is still carrying his grudge against SA since pulling out of that series in Colombo, then shame on him.. The outcry against that was totally uncalled for, from guys living sheltered lives posting on an internet forum, I don't think they had much right to call us cowards for leaving a city during a bomb blast without having a clue what the situation was like on the ground..

Jason's obviously done his cause no good with the comments following his original post, but I think he makes a valid point.. My personal dislike of his team has rapidly faded following the exemplary way in which they conducted their cricket during this whole tournament.. Makes me forget about guys like Arjuna Ranatunga..

At least I can acknowledge one SA fan who can see the point that was made in the original post without getting carried away with their personal feelings.

I hold no grudge from the SA pull out of Colombo. Events todate have if anything justified their doing what they did.

 

[JASON]

Losing the plot?

A worthless nonsensical post deserved nonsensical reply...I have not lost any plot, in all honesty.

 

[JASON]

Don't patronise...

Of course I can see the logic behind it but something about it definately bugs me. Should never surrender until the dying stages and if you do you aren't as glorious in defeat as you could other be.

Ok, So Sri Lanka wanted to surrender and give the Aussies all the glory...Happy..

 

[JASON]

In my opinion its a mental process, and if a Team admits they were beaten by better Team then collectively they will be trying harder to win next time, because its an acknowledgement in their own mind their best was not good enough.

If however they hoodwink themselves and others by finding an excuse or another, as a collective unit they have not realised they have to do better on the next occasion.

And this subconscious failure will continually impede their achieving a better or higher level of performance on the successive occasion.

And they will continue to keep misguidedly believing "Bad Luck and Mambo Jumbo" caused them to lose time after time and not their lack of performance.

 

[Prince EWS]

Dire thread.

 

[pasag]

Dire thread.

Indeed.

 

[Sanz]

Indeed.

Why ? I personally dont like a lot of Jason's post and I dont know why he created this thread. But if one talks about only his first post then I must say there is a lot of truth in what he says about Saffie captain and coach giving stupid excuses for their team's performance, here is one for example :-

South African coach blames long CWC for team’s failure - http://www.radiojamaica.com/news/story.php?category=3&story=35271

“We’re not looking for excuses or anything but I think the length of the tournament and probably the time between games doesn’t allow you to get any momentum. Ideally after the game against England we would have been ready to play again two days later…Just keeping momentum and keeping that confidence going I guess it was an ideal but we only have ourselves to blame for that. Consistency is something we strive for as a unit,”

Yeah Right Mickey - If not for the Schedule you were going to win the World Cup like you had done in last 4 attempts.

 

[Sanz]

After their loss to NZ in Super-8, Here is what Kallis had to say :-

"Kallis meanwhile was more intent on blaming the conditions at this ground - the same ground on which South Africa walloped 356 for 4 only five days ago. "It's not inconsistency in our performance, it's inconsistency in the wicket," he said. "I think it's frustrating when the conditions play such a big role in the game, but the guys did well to stick in there as well as they did. If we'd held onto one or two chances, maybe it could have been a different position. Hopefully we come across a wicket that plays the same throughout the day." "
http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/wc2007/content/story/290489.html

Yeah Right Jack, if not for the conditions, the Cup was all yours.

 

[pasag]

Why ? I personally dont like a lot of Jason's post and I dont know why he created this thread. But if one talks about only his first post then I must say there is a lot of truth in what he says about Saffie captain and coach giving stupid excuses for their team's performance, here is one for example :-

Well by calling something a dire thread, it includes almost everything in the thread which includes Jason losing the plot. Not to mention my posts on the first page which also address why the actual topic of the thread is more or less rubbish as are the thread starters obvious motives for making such a thread. It's weird because Jason is a poster I've respected alot in the past, but it seems in recent times he started to unravel.

 

[Sanz]

If you leave out Jason's motives for creating this thread and talk about his first post without any prejudice, It does seem true that SA have been looking for excues for their performance more often than not.

 

[pasag]

If you leave out Jason's motives for creating this thread and talk about his first post without any prejudice, It does seem true that SA have been looking for excues for their performance more often than not.

But are they excuses if they're the truth? I'll admit the one from Arthur about being overworked is dire, but saying SA didn't do well because the pitches didn't suit them is true, and to say the primary reason they didn't at least get close to Australia in the group stage because Smith went down is also true. I don't think everyone has to come out with preplanned answers to the media that "Yes, we sucked and they were awesome, that is all" when there is often a reason for a sides performance and saying that, imo and only imo, is a sign of honesty more than anything.

And also I think the media trump it up abit more than anything, especially the Australian media against SA. "Kallis meanwhile was more intent on blaming the conditions at this ground" in that article you quoted from cricinfo doesn't look like balanced reporting to me. Smith did praise Australia as too good in the semi final and from match interviews that I remember he did say stuff like "full credit to Bangladesh they fully deserved the win" or something along those lines (although I'm just going from memory here).

 

[Sanz]

Conditions, pitches, umpires, Toss etc are same for everyone, if you are going to blame them after your loss, then yes they are excuses. And just because Smith gave credit to Bangladesh for their win doesn't mean they were not looking for excuses. You can give credit and still give excuses for your poor performance which is what SA did esp in the cases suggested by Jason.

You can blame media all you want, but it doesn't change what Kallis/Micky actually said. The quotes are still out there for everyone to read.

 

[Sanz]

SA didn't do well because the pitches didn't suit them is true.

They are not a good team then, period. If they need conditions to suit for them to be able to well in the world cup then they should not claim themselves as the top team in ODIs.

 

[pasag]

They are not a good team then, period. If they need conditions to suit for them to be able to well in the world cup then they should not claim themselves as the top team in ODIs.

Well yes, I agree, that is a reason why they aren't the best side in the world. It doesn't mean they can't be second best though, especially if none of the middle of the table teams are pushing for ascendancy. Although this isn't the place to argue which is the second best side in ODIs. (Make a thread so I can watch the fireworks if you want )