Australianism

[treamcast34]

From Cricinfo: ""Australianism," wrote Arlott, "means single-minded determination to win - to win within the laws but, if necessary, to the last limit within them. It means where the 'impossible' is within the realm of what the human body can do, there are Australians who believe that they can do it - and who have succeeded often enough to make us wonder if anything is impossible to them. It means they have never lost a match - particularly a Test match - until the last run is scored or their last wicket down."

What is it about them? Are they all born with a node on the brain that says "be an annoying ***** and do the impossible" when the going gets tough? Where does it stem from? Can it be bottled?

 

[Sir Alex]

Absolutely YES in one days and T20s.

Not in tests. It used to be in the days of Warne and Mcgrath, but not any more. Perhaps the gulf in class is easier to bridge in the shorter formats by sheer effort.

 

[treamcast34]

I don't know, they had that last-gasp effort against India in Perth a couple of years back...and the Pakistan win the most recent summer. They've put a couple of these sorts of test wins up.

They're certainly losing more often in the longer form as you'd expect though.

 

[Dissector]

Most teams have pulled off extraordinary comebacks at one time or another though. Calcutta 2001 was a far bigger deal than this TT game and Australia crumpled like a heap in the final session. For that matter Hussey et al didn't so well in a much more manageable chase against India in the TT semis a couple of years back.

For the most part Australia have won in the last decade and a half because they have had a better team. While they have pulled off some amazing escapes like today, I can think of plenty of occassions where they have been at the receiving end in high-pressure games. For example you have the Joburg chase, the fourth innings chase by SA in Australia a few years ago, Monty and Anderson at Lords, Lara's heroics in 1999 just to mention a few.

In general I think the importance of mental toughness at the team level tends to be exagerrated. Some teams are better than others at handling pressure but core skills are far more important.

So the whole idea of "Australianism" is pretty silly unless it just refers to having a high quality cricketing set-up which tends to produce good players.

 

[NasserFan207]

Its a mixture of supreme confidence and ego.

 

[Debris]

Absolutely YES in one days and T20s.

Not in tests. It used to be in the days of Warne and Mcgrath, but not any more. Perhaps the gulf in class is easier to bridge in the shorter formats by sheer effort.

I think you have misread the quote. It is not about whether they win or not, it is more about how much effort they put into trying to win.

 

[Son Of Coco]

They play until the last ball is bowled. I think that's the difference between Australia and some of the other team who are perceived to be mentally weak. So they're always in a position to try to take advantage of any lapses. They also have a reasonable amount of talent to capitalise on that attitude.

Add to that last night's game was a Twenty20 match where it's more likely anything can happen. In test cricket, if you're the better team you'll probably win over a period of 5 days more often than not. In Twenty20 it's different.

Also think a lot of people get self-confidence and arrogance mixed up quite often. Have found quite a lot of sportspeople get called 'arrogant' at times when they're just voicing their belief in their ability. It's the same in golf. Sounds arrogant to us though...

 

[Zinzan]

From a New Zealander's POV, the one thing I admire most about Australians is their fighting attitude & winning mentality, which is why you can never ever write them off. Pakistan gave them an inch towards the end of that game & Aust took the mile.

Will be massively surprised if England (even if they are packed with South African's at the top of the order) beat Australia in the final.

 

[Uppercut]

Yeah, they don't really have it so much in the test side anymore. They quite visibly become disheartened at times and are prone to collapsing all out for under 200.

In LO cricket it's freaky.

 

[Matt79]

Australia don't lose ICC Tournament (eg World Cup, Champions Trophy, and hopefully T20) Finals. I don't think we've lost one since Sri Lanka knocked us off in 96 - obviously we've at times failed to progress through to the finals, but the conversion rate once there is pretty much perfect.

EDIT: Half expecting someone to point one out to me that I've overlooked, but I can't think of where that might have been.

 

[BoyBrumby]

Not just limited to the cricket side, this ever so annoying never say die attitude. More or less every Aussie sports team (or at least the ones I notice) seems to have it.

The Wallabies and the Kangaroos definitely both have it. In the 2003 union world cup a decent but fairly limited Australian side knocked the All Blacks out in the semi-final and very nearly beat a much better England in the final. We really should've won the game by a couple of scores, but Australia hung in (aided, it must be said by some rather sympathetic referreeing of the scrum) and took the game to extra time.

Similarly with the 2003 league Ashes tour. The Kangaroos were without Joey Johns and Gordon Tallis and were behind in every test in the last ten minutes, but won all three by a score or less.

Even the bleedin' Soccerroos have it; 1-0 down v Japan in the last world cup with about 8 mins left and they win 3-1 and twice behind v Croatia and twice equalise for the point they needed to advance.

Nation of ****s, tbh.

 

[Debris]

Yeah, they don't really have it so much in the test side anymore. They quite visibly become disheartened at times and are prone to collapsing all out for under 200.

In LO cricket it's freaky.

Have to disagree. The collapses happened even when Australian side was strong. The decline in test cricket is more to do with lack of talent than lack of attitude. Australia's last tour of SA was a perfect example of the test side winning due to force of will when opposition appeared to have the more talented side.

And the current T20 side has had a few collapses.

 

[Uppercut]

Have to disagree. The collapses happened even when Australian side was strong. The decline in test cricket is more to do with lack of talent than lack of attitude. Australia's last tour of SA was a perfect example of the test side winning due to force of will when opposition appeared to have the more talented side.

The big change is that the lower order caves in under the pressure of top order wickets tumbling- that never used to happen. Symonds, Gilchrist etc. specialised in turning an innings on its head. Now when Australia are reduced to 80/4 they never break 200.

I wouldn't blame a lack of talent. I'd pinpoint North, Haddin and Johnson as players who are fantastically talented lower-order batsmen but struggle to reverse a collapse. Huge seventh and eighth wicket partnerships when 120/5 used to be standard for Australia, and now the opposite is true.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

What's amazing is that the quote in question was about Bradman's team, not anything recent. There's definitely something in the sporting culture that lends itself to those sorts of results. It's just something that Australia manage more often than other teams.

It's not everything though. Mental toughness won't help much if your team isn't that great, and there will probably be a time in the future where Australia isn't among the best in the world once again, but I think the attitude is always there, and that mental strength does play a role in being able to force an unlikely win or performing in high pressure matches like series deciders and tournament finals.

 

[silentstriker]

It's the revolutionary belief that having good players and a high level of fitness and professionalism will lead to more wins than losses.

I think people might be reading a tad too much into it.

 

[BoyBrumby]

What's amazing is that the quote in question was about Bradman's team, not anything recent. There's definitely something in the sporting culture that lends itself to those sorts of results. It's just something that Australia manage more often than other teams.

It's not everything though. Mental toughness won't help much if your team isn't that great, and there will probably be a time in the future where Australia isn't among the best in the world once again, but I think the attitude is always there, and that mental strength does play a role in being able to force an unlikely win or performing in high pressure matches like series deciders and tournament finals.

Yeah, would agree with this. It's why I made the point about the Socceroos having the same attitude. It's a fair guess Oz will never be world champions in the round ball football code (mainly due to competition for talent from three other forms of football), but at their own level (second/third tier) they have a mental resiliance other teams perhaps don't.

 

[tooextracool]

Not just limited to the cricket side, this ever so annoying never say die attitude. More or less every Aussie sports team (or at least the ones I notice) seems to have it.

The Wallabies and the Kangaroos definitely both have it. In the 2003 union world cup a decent but fairly limited Australian side knocked the All Blacks out in the semi-final and very nearly beat a much better England in the final. We really should've won the game by a couple of scores, but Australia hung in (aided, it must be said by some rather sympathetic referreeing of the scrum) and took the game to extra time.

Similarly with the 2003 league Ashes tour. The Kangaroos were without Joey Johns and Gordon Tallis and were behind in every test in the last ten minutes, but won all three by a score or less.

Even the bleedin' Soccerroos have it; 1-0 down v Japan in the last world cup with about 8 mins left and they win 3-1 and twice behind v Croatia and twice equalise for the point they needed to advance.

Nation of ****s, tbh.

Yeah I think its their never say die attitude and confidence in these sorts of situations that is incomparable. They were comfortably outplayed by England in the 2005 Ashes in the last 4 tests and yet somehow they cam fairly close to winning 3 of them. Quite honestly, that series should never have been as close as it ended up being.

 

[Jono]

Uppercut and SS, you're ignoring notions of culture in sport.

Sure its okay to look at everything through a black or white scope sometimes, but I think its quite clear that even when Australia don't have the best team, they very very rarely lay down and die. Hell even in last year's T20 there are times when they looked like they may sneak through despite playing like ****, through sheer belief that they can win from any position.

 

[Uppercut]

Uppercut and SS, you're ignoring notions of culture in sport.

Sure its okay to look at everything through a black or white scope sometimes, but I think its quite clear that even when Australia don't have the best team, they very very rarely lay down and die. Hell even in last year's T20 there are times when they looked like they may sneak through despite playing like ****, through sheer belief that they can win from any position.

Thing is, the notion of a team "giving it their all" and "never saying die" and "showing great spirit" is used so often it's become somewhat devalued. People say it about Bangladesh ffs. So I'm determined not to use it lightly. You have to credit Australia for their phenomenal professionalism, but I don't think the current test side has the rare and special mentality of the previous one- the ability to play the best cricket of their careers when under the most immense pressure.

 

[Jono]

Its not "when under the most immense pressure" tbh.

It's "when down and out"

They're not necessarily one and the same.

And I think its unfair to not credit easily the one sports team I've seen in my life time that is "never dead until absolutely buried" with the rare quality of having a never say die attitude because its become cliche.